Xbox Series X doesn't obey Full RGB setting when in HDR content

Discus and support Xbox Series X doesn't obey Full RGB setting when in HDR content in XboX Insiders to solve the problem; There is an issue with Xbox Series X not outputing full RGB in HDR10 mode despite outputting full RGB in SDR. When you launch any HDR10 content, Xbox... Discussion in 'XboX Insiders' started by /u/Derpcrawler, Nov 30, 2020.

  1. Xbox Series X doesn't obey Full RGB setting when in HDR content


    There is an issue with Xbox Series X not outputing full RGB in HDR10 mode despite outputting full RGB in SDR. When you launch any HDR10 content, Xbox will force switch itself to RGB limited.

    I am on full HDMI2.1 TV - LG OLED C9. This behaviour is very annoying, because PS5 by default outputs in Full RGB 12 bit on compatible TV, which gives more accurate colors and true blacks on OLED, using limited has issues with near dark scenes in some games, because PS5 games are mastered for 12-bit full RGB content.

    This issue should be fixed, forcing limited RGB is suboptimal in HDR content where most next gen games are mastered for full RGB, especially since most TVs don't allow different profiles for different HDMI inputs, forcing people to change Black Level settings every time they play on Xbox.

    LG C9 HDMI signal debug menu for PS5: https://i.imgur.com/E0q7att.jpg

    Notice RGB Quantization says "Full".

    Here is Series X signal debug info: https://i.imgur.com/7kGc5ks.jpg

    RGB Quantization is set to "Limited", despite specifically setting it to Full PC Range in Xbox AV settings menu. This causes Xbox games in HDR having washed out look, because my TV is calibrated for optimal HDR experience on PS5 and PC.

    submitted by /u/Derpcrawler
    [link] [comments]
     
    /u/Derpcrawler, Nov 30, 2020
    #1
  2. oryan_dunn Win User

    Display Calibration and RGB, black levels

    A long post follows....

    RGB TV / RGB Limited means content is mastered at 16 = black and 235 = white.

    RGB PC / RGB Full means content is mastered at 0 = black and 255 = white.

    No matter what settings you select in your TV or the XB1, when a source outputs RGB, it sends 8bits (0-255) per channel (unless you select a higher bit depth, but that's for a different discussion).

    If you have a source that is outputting RGB Limited for RGB Limited and your TV is set to RGB Limited, the TV should be calibrated so that 16 = black and 235 = white. The way this is usually done is through calibration patterns that have information below
    16 or above 235, also known as blacker than black or whiter than white. For the XB1, this is the top/bottom black/white bars and the closed eye and sun in the built in calibration program. When a display chain such as this is calibrated properly, you're
    not supposed to see the closed eye or the sun, and the top two and bottom two bars should look the same color. If you can see the closed eye or sun, then the display is to bright and/or to contrast-y.

    If you have a source that is outputting RGB Full and your TV is set to RGB Full, the TV should be calibrated so that 0 = black and 255 = white. Here is where the confusion starts. To properly expand content mastered for RGB Limited (most all TV and movies,
    and likely other content as well), the device accepting the RGB Limited content and outputting RGB Full is responsible for expanding this properly. That necessarily means clipping below black and above white. For 8 bit RGB, you can't send higher than 255,
    and there are no negative RGB values. In this case, no matter how bright you set your TV, you'll never see the closed eye. It's impossible to see blacker than black on RGB full showing content mastered for RGB Limited. If you are seeing below black or above
    white, then that means the program expanding the RGB Limited mastered content is not expanding properly.

    Now, with that said, I think there are some issues. I have no knowledge other than my hunches about how the XB1 works. My hunch is that it either treats all apps as having content mastered for RGB Limited and applies the expansion to all games/apps/movies/etc.
    Or, the game/app can tell the system that it's content is RGB Limited or RGB Full so the XB1 can expand/not expand as necessary. If it's the latter option, then I think apps like IE don't properly advertise their content is RGB full. Also, apps like the
    Media Player photo viewer should be RGB Full, while the video player in the Media Player app should be RGB Limited. That's why when you set the XB1 to RGB TV and your display to RGB Full, photos and content on IE look right, because you're basically turning
    off the RGB Limited -> RGB Full expander. But, that only fixes RGB Full content. When you do that, anything mastered for RGB Limited will look very washed out. I've read where most developers target RGB Limited, so I'm wondering if the XB1 just assumes
    all content is RGB Limited and expands carte blanche. If that's the case, then it seems like the "fix" is to allow an app to tell the system if it's content is RGB Limited or RGB Full so the XB1 can properly apply the 16-235 -> 0-255 expander.

    So, if you see games that look "more correct" when the XB1 is set to RGB TV and your display is set to RGB Full, then I suspect the game has been mastered to RGB Full and the XB1 is normally incorrectly applying the RGB expander. With the XB1 set to RGB
    TV and your display set to RGB Limited or the XB1 set to RGB PC and your display set to RGB Full, you'd be crushing blacks/whites, and I suspect this is what most people are seeing. The developers have "worked around" the issue by mastering games to RGB Limited,
    which for people with displays that accept RGB Full result in a slightly reduced number of total available colors.
  3. M3tal Daz3 Win User

    Xbox One S black levels?

    TV content is authored such that a value of 16 (on a 0-255 scale) represents full black and 235 represents full white (this color span = “RGB Limited”) and assumes the viewer's TV has been calibrated to show full black upon receiving a pixel value of 16
    and to show full white upon receiving a value of 235. Xbox One is assumed to be connected to a TV (not a PC monitor), and we make our best efforts to optimize video content (movies, TV shows, content authored specific experience for video levels, i.e. "RGB
    Limited"), consistent with CE devices.

    Switching to RGB Full will cause loss of visual dynamic range on a properly calibrated TV.

    Basically, you should always use the TV (RGB Limited) Color Space display setting on Xbox One. All video content (TV shows, Movies, Blu-ray, DVD, etc.) is authored for (RGB Limited). You’ll actually lose visual dynamic range if you select Color Space = PC
    (RGB Full).

    The "RGB Limited" setting could be named more accurately.'

    Note they have now changed the name to RGB Standard and PC RGB. If you use RGB Standard then 99% of your "crushed black" problems will be gone

    For more info:
    https://support.xbox.com/en-US/xbox-one/console/adjust-display-settings
  4. JTF195 Win User

    Display Calibration and RGB, black levels

    As of the most recent Xbox 360 and Xbox One updates, the problem is still not fixed.

    I have my TV calibrated and configured properly. I have tested it with my both my PS3 and PC set to RGB Full and RGB Limited, and my Wii U (which outputs RGB Limited)

    It works perfectly with all 3 devices.

    On both the Xbox 360 and Xbox One, however, the output from the both the RGB Full and RGB limited options have 16 levels of black crushing and 16 levels of white crushing when the TV is set to the corresponding mode, and only look normal when the TV is set
    to RGB Full, and the Xbox is set to RGB Limited.

    I don't have recording equipment, but others have recorded output and tested the black levels in photoshop to verify this issue.

    Essentially the problem breaks down as follows:

    Black Levels

    15-239

    - PS RGB Limited option, Wii U, PC RGB Limited output

    0-255

    - Xbox RGB Limited option, PS RGB Full option, PC RGB Full output

    (-16)-271 (values out of range by 16 levels)

    - Incorrect Xbox RGB Full option
  5. ROBIN H 25 Win User

    White Flickers while watching movies/streaming? 4k UHD 60hz monitor no HDR

    I had the same / similar issue with my old 4K 60hz none HDR / HDMI 2.0 monitor when watching movies and some times in games with the Series X,

    As soon as i upgraded my monitor to a 4K 144hz monitor that has HDR / HDMI 2.1 ports, i no longer had this problem,

    I'm not sure what the problem is, but my guess is that the HDMI 2.1 port on Series X doesn't play well with HDMI 2.0 port of monitors, or it's the Series X trying to force HDR on, even if the monitor does not have / support HDR and the HDR in Series X menu's is turned off.
  6. SILKYJJ Win User

    How to make the graphics better

    The RGB settings are in the settings for Xbox One not in game. Go to Settings>Display & Sound > Then change the Limited RGB setting to Full RGB setting.
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Xbox Series X doesn't obey Full RGB setting when in HDR content

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