Bitstream setting-Why forced to choose DTS or Dolby?!

Well given all the technical knowledge being tossed around in this thread I'm hoping someone here can help with an issue I'm having hopefully. I recently spent the course of no less than 4 days going back and fourth with MS's online support over my audio
issues. I have a 5.1 surround sound set up on my HDTV. While playing FM5 one day I noticed that the female announcers voice was extremely low. I tried adjusting it through the in-game settings and nothing. Then I noticed zero to limited audio from blu-ray's
(mainly the voices) and finally zero voice from "coach" in the Kinect Rivals PreSeason demo. (although the other audio could be heard) I have my audio settings to 5.1 and my HDMI to "HDMI" not "AutoDetect". I have played with the various options over and over
and the only success I get is when I switch to "Stereo Uncompressed". This is disappointing considering my PS3, my Xbox 360, and my tv all have no problems outputting in 5.1 surround sound with the same system. Only my Xbox one refuses to play nice.

After going back and forth with MS support, the only option I was left with was literally to purchase either an optical audio cable or a whole new surround sound (they basically stated politely that it "might" be my only option in order to hear 5.1 and they
"highly" recommended it as the solution). This is EXTREMELY disappointing when you consider the cost of the console and how my last gen consoles all play nice without an additional expense requirement. My current surround sound does not have an optical input
option so I'm wondering...would it be possible to directly input the Xbox One into my HDTV via optical, then have the audio (regardless of being lesser in quality on output) spit back out through the tv to my receiver via the old RCA "yellow, red, white" jacks?

I'm just looking at the cost of a $14 optical cable vs. a $300 or more surround sound at this point.

Thanks for any help with this...

 

Even on 7.1uncompressed there seems to bealmost no activity in the surrounds or rear surrounds, just ambient backround music. It eems like the decode from the one is similar to dolby pro logicII on a stereo source. That's what it sounds like anyway. The
lfe channel seems to be lsss robust too

 

I was Trying to figure out what was wrong with my surround sound was a pain. I found support online saying to switch to bit-stream and this worked but the sound was noticeably worse in quality and loudness, and this rightly so because it is incomparable
to uncompressed sound direct to my Marantz receiver. I am disappointed that this is the only option available for a console that calls itself the all in one package. If it were truly all in one deal then movie watching would be at least an equal experience
to gaming and this just isn't the case. The truly sad part is that the Ps3 even has better capabilities than this new elite xbox (clarity is unmatched and surround is submersive).

--Until they do away with the need for bit-streaming in order to use surround sound I will continue to watch blu-ray movies on the PS3 as it is apparently ahead of the game when compared to microsofts' newest and most prestigious system. To add to that last
statement, the Ps3 has better 3d software as well when compared to the xbox one which is harder on the eyes. I am a forever xbox gamer but I am yet to be sold on this new aspect that it has to offer.

Please fix this seemingly simple problem in your next update.

Sincerely,

the consumer

 

Some folks should keep in mind that some manufacturers prevent you from outputting anything beyond 2 channel from the TV.

For example I have a Samsuing 32 inch LCD. It has an optical output. Problem is, it doesn't output 5.1. This is part of the DRM. This is a huge part of why things are messing up when it comes to the sound and why some of the audio options work oddly (Using
my above setup, if I output 5.1, it drops all but the left and right channel. 7.1 it takes a dump. My DSS is 7.1 capable but it doesn't work through the TV.)

So if you are using your TV to receive via HDMI and plan on outputting via optical to a DSS it won't work right. You need to go direct to your DSS with the optical out from the xbox.

For those stuck in a situation like me, you can buy a TOSlink SWITCH (not splitter, you need a powered switch) that will accept 2 or 3 inputs and output 1. That may alleviate your problems if it is related to the optical pass-through or HDMI DRM.

 

@WillyBurz

I agree with you. But this is very difficult on a game console that mixes in UI sounds, sounds of snapped apps and whatnot. So the console kind of has to do the decoding, which is why real bitstream pass-through just can't work.

 

Wow, it's amazing how so many people miss the point on this. First of all, please stop telling us that 7.1 uncompressed is the same as DTS-HD, or TRUE HD, or whatever the codec happens to be. NO, THEY ARE NOT THE SAME, and if they were, then we would have
the capability to do either or wouldn't we. When my receiver, (and most others) receive a codec such as DTS, Dolby, and all of the versions of both of those, my receiver is then able to manipulate certain things that it CANNOT when it receives multi channel
PCM signals. When the receiver RECEIVES the actual native codec from a 5.1 soundtrack, it can add PLllx or PLllz to matrix sounds to the rear and or height, or wide speakers. That's a HUGE loss of capability from the perspective of a person who owns a $2,000
Denon receiver (4308ci). And as other's have stated, there is simply no way of knowing that the decoding is being done in the exact same way, and that the sound is exactly as good as it could, or should be,...blah blah blah. Here are the bottom line issues

-PCM and native codec are not the same

-People know better than what you are feeding them, so just fix it

-If they are REALLY the same, offer people the option of either or (like my $49 Insignia blu ray player did back in 2009!!)

There are a contingent of intelligent audiophiles with expensive systems that are trying to decide whether to buy an Xbox One or a PS4 and issues like this one send ALL of them to the other guys. It's true.

 

No, RattledWoodwork, I'm afraid you're missing the point here.

The quality of an uncompressed PCM audio stream is in no way inferior to a DTS-HD or Dolby TrueHD stream. However, people are still well aware that they are not the same. I am anyway.

I figure you want the console to pass-through the undecoded Blu-ray audio stream to your receiver. Due to the whole concept of the Xbox One's user interface, this is not practical at all. In contrast to a generic BD player, the Xbox One can do a whole bunch
of things while watching a BD: It allows you to snap apps, go back to your home screen and display the movie in a small window, display notifications and so on.

Therefore, the console needs to decode the audio track stored on the disc, mix in the UI sounds and then send it to the receiver. Otherwise, the whole UI concept will be reduced to absurdity. Please think about
it. If you have to decode the audio anyway, does it make sense to re-encode it to a proprietary format afterwards, or does it make more sense to send it to the receiver as is, that is uncomressed PCM?

I don't know as to why your $2,000 Denon receiver is able to manipulate certain things that it cannot when it receives a 5.1/7.1 PCM signal. But with all due respect, these are shortcomings of your $2,000 Denon device. If you're talking about settings such
as dynamic range, those have to be made on the console, because, as explained above, the console decodes all audio. Fortunately, the console supports dynamic range decoding.

The bottom line is, if you want the best possible audio experience, you should avoid using your Xbox One as a Blu-ray player anyway. Buy a decent player (in case you don't already have one) that works well with your $2,000 Denon receiver. I'm sure that will
be able to pass-through the DTS-HD / Dolby TrueHD audio and let your Denon decode it. Due to the way it was designed, the Xbox One is not the right device to do that. But keep in mind the Xbox One allows you to do a lot of other things a Blu-ray player can't
do in exchange.

 

I'm with RattledWoodwork on this. The sound put out by the Xbox One, especially for Blu-Rays and even some DVDs, is very inferior to the native codec. A good receiver like my Harman Kardon does a much better job at the (I can only imagine how much worse
this is with a great reciever like the Denon).

I'm also not buying the "it is hard" argument. My PS4 handles sound so much better. Granted, there is no "snap" but notifications and other sound added don't break TrueHD or DTS-HD sent to the receiver. However, the PS4 is not billed as a central media center.
I bought the One for Halo, a few other exclusives, and the TV-cable box-Kinect abilities. I've very disappointed that there is no option for passing disk and other source sound direct to my reciever.

I'm bummed about this... Microsoft please fix this! Make it an option, even if not the default, for people who like a better quality audio experience. For now I will continue to use the other console I own for Blu-Ray and other media playback.

 

In the settings, you can turn off the sounds for the snapped app. It would make sense if one were to turn off snapped sounds, that the Xbox wouldn't have to do any encoding.

Right now, I select Bitstream (both DTS and Dolby) and my rear channels are NOT discrete. They sound like Pro Logic II, where a stereo signal is used to create rear sounds - basically the sounds leak out of the front speakers too.

I don't think the Bitstream DTS or Dolby signal I'm getting is 5.1 channels.

 

Yes, the bitstream DTS or Dolby Digital setting gives you true 5.1 channels. Check your receiver settings if you have the impression the channels are not discrete.

@puffergeek

So the PS4 adds notifications and other sounds to the DTS-HD or Dolby True HD stream? Youknow what this means, right? It doesn't pass through the audio stream either. Granted, it does seem to be able to output DTS-HD and Dolby True HD. But what's the benefit?
You're arguing that most receivers, like your Harman Kardon, do a much better job at decoding the audio then the console does. But don't you realize that even the PS4 touches the audio beforehand? Otherwise it wouldn't be able to mix in UI sounds.

 

And please let me add that if the PS4's audio quality is indeed better (I'm not denying it), this is not related to the output format but to the Xbox One's decoder being inferior then. So that would have to be improved at this point. A lossless audio track
(such das Dolby True HD) is identical to its uncompressed source as long as the decoder decodes and processes it correctly. Letting the console decode the audio track is not a problem at all,
unless the decoder does a very bad job.

 

Bambusbieger, I am going to have to disagree with you.

Also, I'm not sure the PS4 does modify anything... it might just play the notify sound then resume the normal bitstream... I don't recall how it works. I disabled notifications when playing video after the first notification I got. If they do modify the
bitstream, they put it all back together with the very same codec. There is no downgraded "DTS" or "Dolby Digital" going on. And something very funny _is_ going on with the Xbox One... it is not a real "5.1" anything, especially when it "downgrades" a 7.1
DTS-HD into something that sounds, frankly, terrible.

I'm not an audio engineer, but I am something of an amateur audiophile (as much as I often dislike that label). I think sound matters as much (or more) than picture and I buy Blu-Ray only for the huge sound improvement over digital distributions.

I'm also not a multi-billion dollar company trying to position its newest console as an entertainment hub and the place to go for all living room content. Microsoft should get to fixing this right away. (I assume they have audio engineers working on the
Xbox team.)

This stuff matters! I'm looking at an Atmos receiver and if the Xbox One cannot pass on the raw bitstream I will be bypassing it for all audio. Even for cable TV. If the Xbox One is going to be a multimedia hub it needs to get the audio fixed ASAP. Even
for games, if I'm buying a non-exclusive title and Microsoft hasn't fixed this audio issue, I will be going with the competition's platform.

 

I love high-end audio. I got the Xbox One after hearing it could play MKV's. Well needless to say it wouldn't play over 90% of them because they have DTS and the Xbox one doesn't work with them. So I would say Microsoft should stop saying they can play MKV's
because the majority of them it can't. Luckily my little $75 roku can. Next I was ok I can still play blu-rays right? Nope. The xbox can't output DTS-MA and only outputs PCM. It sounds no-where near as good as my $20 blu-ray player. So sadly I bought this
as a media player but really it can only play games. I also question the audio quality of the games. I almost wish I could of bought a PS4 especially if the audio works correctly on it. I am beyond dissapointed!

 

7.1 uncompressed, mutes my rear surround speaker on bf4 because bf4 doesn't use a rear surround channel. When I set it on bitstream and dolby, the pro logic kicks in and I get my rears to blend in the sound. I recommend leaving it on dolby because then
if a game or movie doesn't have a rear channel, you will still get sound from it, aka pro logic or ES

 

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