Are you ready for X1X and prepared to download extra 50 GB on every game????

Just confirming what you say.

Some things in DirectX 12 might also help automatically by providing some effects if hardware drivers tell they are there, like more of those for X1X.

Game rendering engines may have some shadowing etc that are applied if available in GPU capabilities.

Software enumerate capabilities on any interface they use - and if they get flags for that certain things are supported they are used - assuming rendering engine in core is the same whether PC, Playstation or Xbox.

 

Ok, so you don't go on any more rants about how terrible it is the sizes of patches and all that stuff, lets just clear some thing up, because you seem to be making a few mistakes.

1: All games will be able to do super sampling, that is being coded into the OS, so the games developers don't have to do anything, which pretty much clears up one of your statements.

"Some have talked about how X1X would run native 4k and downsize for better looks in 1080p - this is not going to happen" Wrong

2: As of yet nobody knows how large the Xbox One X updates will be, as of yet we only know of a couple (Forza 7 and GoW) and looking on the Xbox store wont tell you neither, as the download size of the game file will include content updates (GoW gives free
content, so its original download was roughly 50GB now its 90GB because of all the free content) Which again clears up another statement.

"As I have found, some games have 100% or more as patch download size compared to full game download at purchase." Again wrong

If your not happy with the Xbox One X that's fine, don't get one, but please don't spread false information, this doesn't help anyone.

 

Enhanced games will look great, of that I have no doubt. Yet simply running a game on better hardware will not mean that it will automatically look or run better.

Take Knights of the Old Republic, newly backward compatible with the One. I first played it on my PC on a CRT monitor with a resolution of 1024x768, the game looked fantastic. I installed it again recently on my far more modern PC and..well lets just say at
1920x1080, the game doesn't quite look as good as I remembered. I have to point out that the game also requires a widescreen patch in order to support modern resolutions. The biggest problem of course is that the game simply doesn't have the texture quality
to maintain its look when the resolution is increased. The assets simply aren't there.

Now I know that is somewhat of a extreme example because of its age but it holds true for even more recent games. If a game is 900p on the One and doesn't include textures of any higher quality than that on the disc or in the download, then simply running the
game at a higher resolution on the One X will just make the lower resolution textures look worse.

 

Not savvy at such things, but wouldn't it be easier for MS and/or Sony to include file unzip program in their next console update and any game etc update after that be a zipped or compressed file?

Wouldn't that make dl'ing huge files faster or am I completely off the mark?

 

I am afraid you are wrong - and I my statement are true.

And for the record I have X1 since a year and considering X1X in the future - so trying to make people aware what you are in for.

Statements

1. "Some have talked about how X1X would run native 4k and downsize for better looks in 1080p - this is not going to happen" Wrong

Well sadly not many games will run true 4k - just take a look at games presented for Xbox One X Enhanced list - a fraction has anything written in "¤K" column.

The power of X1X is not overwhelming that you easily render in 2160p - it will be upscaling to the larger part of game population.

On Digital Foundry many articles state about 1440p being quite good compromize to upscale to 2160.

2. "As I have found, some games have 100% or more as patch download size compared to full game download at purchase." Again wrong

Again am I right - I'm afraid.

Elite Dangerous - game size installed 13.5 GB and download patch day one 13.5 GB.

Adam's Venture Origin - game size installed 5 GB and day one patch 5 GB.

This is the police - game size about 4 GB and day one patch 4 GB.

Constructor - game size 4 GB and day one patch size 4 GB.

Infinite Air Mark McMorris - game size installed 3 GB and day one patch size 3 GB.

The Golf Club Collectors Edition - game size 4 GB and day one patch size 4 GB.

The we have some sinners that are close to 50% download for patch day one, which is already something weird IMO - but since games are so large a real problem:

Tom clancy's The Division - 34 GB game size and 17.6 GB day one patch size.

Steep - 30 GB game size and day one patch size 15 GB.

Rory McIlroy PGA Tour - 27 GB game size and 12.5 GB day one patch size

 

I'm sure it is compressed to death already.

Every patch does not increase game size on disk that much - most are replaced files slightly larger than before.

So downloaded game files are unpacked/unzipped and replace executable files on disk.

I started to do a lot of photo and video a year ago - and even those files does not compress much when doing disk backups.

Even the raw files(CR2) compress just another 10% if using the compression on disk as on Windows computers - you always do that to any folder or file.

So textures for games is probably squashed to death already as downloaded.

Just some games like Tom clancy's Ghost Recon Wildlands that does not have smart patch downloads - I had over three months patches 8.1 GB, 8.4 GB and 8.7 GB or close to that - meaning you download every patch over and over, it seems. And uninstalled then
this summer, but now I installed and it want to download 10.3 GB as patch. So what everybody has to download is larger and larger along with number of patches done to game - looks that way to me anyway. Easy for developers - bad for us gamers, at least the
half or so not having infinite internet.

 

May I ask, do you know what AMD specialize in? Did you know Microsoft has partnered with AMD for helping to create the Xbox One X console?

AMD has technology and hardware, and software in that technology and hardware.... that can help make games run better, regardless if game developers support the Xbox One X or not.

Perfect Picture with Steady Video Technology | AMD

Latest Technologies | Gaming | Graphics and Server | AMD

This is an official list from Microsoft!, of games which will be Xbox One X Enhanced. It's a pretty long and good list which what looks to be over 100 games! which will be Xbox One X Enhanced.

https://www.xbox.com/en-NZ/games/xbox-one/xbox-one-x-enhanced-list

You may not think that there will be a difference between the X, and the S or Original; but there is a difference if an optometrist (who pays more attention to things they see, ahm) can tell. A 5400rpm HDD is slower than a 7200rpm HDD. So the X can boot
up faster, shutdown faster, load games faster, and has a way more powerful GPU.

Embrace technology, change and innovation. Life involves changes. As the borg would say, "Resistance is futile.....". As Microsoft's CEO puts it:

"Our industry does not respect tradition, it only respects innovation"

"We are the company that enables people to do more, to play, have more fun, create more. So, in some sense we refer to ourselves as the do more company".

And this is what the X achieves. In play games better, it's a more responsive console for the user, instead of waiting for longer loading screens and weaker hardware to do what we require.

Sure people are fine to stick with the S and original and even Xbox 360. After all, sticking with Xbox 360 is fine cause it's not the hardware that matters.... right?.... Xbox 360 does have a large gaming library.

 

Also, The Knights of the Old Republic is a really old game, 2003. And CRT like analogue television with 576i picture thingy before HDTV's came out. HDTV screens may not do too well with upscaling and beautifying video THAT OLD. But if we look at games around
Xbox One's era (2013+), these run in 720p (not 720i, not 480i, not CRT not analogue TV's) or higher. Thus modern technology from AMD can definitely improve this kind of image video quality automatically, regardless of game developer support. AMD and Nvidia
have optimization technology built into their hardware, fact, which improves and optimizes video quality, regardless of what updates the game developer releases. Thus it CAN automatically do this kind of thing in many cases.

Don't be ignorant of the potential of the Xbox One X. Also it has AMD technology running on it too. You don't see game developers supporting EVERY GPU and CPU model out there............. That is why when people do comparison videos
on YouTube between an AMD and GTX or same brand different model, piece of hardware, there is a difference. Did the game developer provide a specific update for that specific hardware? No. It's magic which can be achieved from hardware and technology behind
it.

 

KOTR would have looked much better on PC because it probably utilised higher resolution textures on that system from the get go.

Original Xbox was running that game with PIII type CPU @ 700MHz and GeForce 3 based GPU. The whole system only had 64MB Ram

By contrast, the PC requirement was a PIII @ 1GHz 256 MB Ram and a Direct X8 compatible GPU with 32MB on board.

Even with the Windows overhead, that's heck of a lot more system resources available to PC.

 

They are already looking into ways of making the downloads smaller & taking up less hard drive space.

 

Not really. Textures are already compressed, zipping wouldn't make much differance. Ever tried to compress a Jpeg file? They don't compress very well, if it all.

 

Yes smiles, I know what AMD have done with the One. I've been using the technology AMD own (since they bought ATI) since before you were born. Now I don't claim to know everything about computer technology but I'm always willing to learn.

Of course there are certain tip and tricks that can eck a little more performance out but they can also have the complete opposite effect if they are trying to get things running on unsupported hardware or software. Microsoft's own game mode on Windows 10,
which is meant to increase game performance, actually has the exact opposite effect with some titles. Just because it is meant to do something, doesn't mean it always will.

Also I have never said that there will not be a difference between the three generations of the Xbox One, I absolutely know there will be in fact. However I also know that games will need to be released or patched in order to support that. As I said, just because
something is newer doesn't always mean it will run better.

Since we are on AMD, let's mention Mass Effect, on the PC I must confess. When the game was ported to the PC the developers chose on AMD processors to make use of the 3D Now instruction set those processors employed. However modern AMD processors don't have
that instruction set and so at certain points of the game (mainly Ilos and Noveria) all the characters, Shepard and NPCs, turn into black blobs. Because that 3D Now instruction set is missing the CPU doesn't know how to run the game properly.

Of course Microsoft doesn't have as big an issue as the PC in this situation and it is entirely possible that they could avoid all problems. However games designed to run on one piece of hardware won't always run well, if at all, on newer and better hardware.

Say for example a developer made use of the ESRAM for a certain task on the base Xbox One, the Xbox One X not having that as part of the system could cause problems. Sure they may be able to brute force their way around it but it is equally as possible big
problems could be cause. Devs have to account for the ESRAM because all games must run on all versions of the Xbox One.

 

It seems that some people have received X1X enhanced patches for more games than me. Here's the games that have been patched for me at the time of posting this: -

• Gears of War 4
• Titanfall 2
• World of Tanks

However, some people have received patches for Killer Instinct and Diablo 3, both of which I own and are installed. They've definitely not been patched and no patch is available when I launch each game. Not sure what's going on there.

Which games have been patched for you guys?

 

Ok, so a lot of the games may not be able to render at native 4K, but that doesn't matter. Whatever resolution the game is rendered it is then downscaled to the resolution of the screen. In doing this it will ALWAYS look better than a native 1080p.

As for all those games you've mentioned, all those patch sizes are for DAY ONE patches, nothing to do with the Xbox One X updates. Rory Mcllroy for example isn't going to be Xbox One X enhanced, same with constructor, this is the police Adams Venture Origin.

I really do think your getting confused between day one updates, and Xbox One X enhanced updates, they are two very different things.

 

Not confused - this was day one updates, and you denied there were such large updates as 100% of game - and just illustrate what you are in for - with normal X1.

And would be nice if it at least stayed on those sizes - not adding 4k everywhere because you happend to get X1X(for those games X1X enhanced then).

About 1080p - one part of discussion is also about whether Enhanced games will look better on X1X in 1080p as well.

I think anything on a 4k/2160p monitor will look better than 1080p-monitor - both later and better technology - new generation.

Some here also stated that 360 games look better on modern 4k display they bought.

So what part actually depend on higher resolution or what is is technology boost - hard to say.

Looking at what eyes actually can perceive as better looking - I tend to think technology is the real boost - and also possibly why devs don't bother with 2160p native so much.

I use some software to upscale photos for printing - since photo often are about 350 dpi and printers much higher - and technology and algorithms for upscaling developed quite a bit.

So using more power to steady framerates is probably better used power than going all 2160p native.

Either way I hope everybody with 4k stay will be extremely satsified with purchase of monitor and X1X as well.

Just wanted some buzz over 4k content downloads - and possibly that MS get aware of this - and make firmware update with ability to block that if running 1080p on X1X.

I never intended to rant X1X itself. I love what MS is doing with this - just that they think twice how they do things.

X1 has about 1.3 TFLOPS and think 360 was about 0.3-0.4 TFLOPS or so - so 4 times boost in power in X1 - but also 4 times larger size of most things.

Now with X1X has about 4 times power of X1 - and again things seem to be 4 times larger.

So all power is lost in shuffling as much extra data around instead - and it becomes a bit obscene with 100 - 200 GB size of games.

Textures is a way for developers to make processing less cpu/gpu intense - compared to do true 3D modelling of everything.

With X1X the power might be closer to actually do more true 3D modelling instead.

I installed Resident Evil 7 Bioshock yesterday and played a bit. It does not look anything better than if you run on 360/PS3.

And think this version is developed for X1 only, not like HD releases that are remastered 360 games.

I got RE6 HD today, and installed and will check how it looks later.

My view is overall - any of games I have on X1 might just as well be on 360 - it does not change the gaming experience all that much.

I even buy tv series on DVD mostly - since I find full HD on bluray does not matter as much as I though at first.

Upscaled DVD looks stunning as tv-series and films are created with modern equipment - so sensors in modern cameras are developed a lot in later years.

And series done with full hd or even 4k - then downscaled to dvd format - is probably big part of looks of it all.

But film is a bit different in that it's lossy compression involved as well with H264 etc - games probably are not affected the same way and may proove to be better looking in comparison.